PRESENTER: Adnan Oktar, thank you so much for being with us today.

PRESENTER: Thank you. How long have you believed in Creation, and did you ever believe in evolution?

ADNAN OKTAR: I have not believed in evolution since I was a child, because the existence of Allah is so manifest that I realized His existence even with the mind of a child. I clearly saw the existence of creation.

ADNAN OKTAR: Ninety-five percent of people in Turkey do not believe in evolution. The level in other Islamic countries, the level of people who do not believe in evolution, is also rising. Because my struggle against Darwinism, through the internet and books, has shown people the truth. People are now moving out of darkness and toward the light.

PRESENTER: Ok. So I want to make sure I am clear, Ahmet, he is saying that he believes 95% of Muslims in the Muslim world reject Darwinian evolution? That’s what he is saying?

PRESENTER: Ok. What do they teach in the schools? Do they teach Darwinian evolution in Islamic schools?

ADNAN OKTAR: Yes, they teach Darwin’s theory of evolution. Creation is glossed over in a few words, along the lines of “some people also say that.”  

PRESENTER: Interesting, so most of the Muslims in Turkey, that’s where Mr. Oktar is from, Turkey, most of the Muslims in Turkey do not believe in Darwinian evolution, but Darwinian evolution is what’s being taught in the schools. That’s very interesting. Hang on just a moment, we are going into a commercial break. And then we’ll pick up the conversation in just two minutes more with Adnan Oktar. He goes by the pen name Harun Yahya. He is the author of the Atlas of Creation and you can go to his web site; harunyahya.com, let me spell that for you everyone; it is harunyahya.com. And more coming up two minutes from now here on the Bob Dutko Show.

PRESENTER: You’re listening to the Bob Dutka Show, continuing our discussion with Adnan Oktar, who goes by the pen name Harun Yahya. He is an Islamic creationist who rejects Darwinian evolution. He is from Turkey and we’re discussing his book the “Atlas of Creation”. Mr. Oktar, this book, you have been distributing to many different places, trying to get it into schools. Could you explain where you have been getting the book distributed and what the reaction has been?

ADNAN OKTAR: The Atlas of Creation is a work that has had a huge impact. Because we have shown in it that there are 250 million fossils, but no intermediate fossils. I showed there are 250 million fossils that all prove Creation. People used to imagine the exact opposite, they imagined there were millions of fossils that prove Darwinism. I showed there are 250 million fossils that prove Creation. And I proved there is not one single intermediate fossil of the kind referred to by Darwinists. I even said I would give 10 trillion Turkish lira to anyone producing a single intermediate fossil. All Darwinists have done so far is demagoguery. They cannot produce a single intermediate fossil. In addition, it is impossible for a single protein to come into being by chance. I have proven that scientifically. Dawkins even says that beings from outer space created them; he says that only aliens could have produced proteins and chromosomes, the chromosomes in the human body. That is a clear indication of the defeat of Darwinism. The publishers meet the costs of the books. In the same way that Dawkins’ publishers defray the costs of his books and market them, and even market them on the sides of buses, so my publisher defrays the costs in the same way.

PRESENTER: OK. Now here in America, our government schools teach Darwinian evolution, and creation scientists are not able to get their books into the government schools. The creation books are censored in our government schools. Is that same problem going on in Turkey? Are there some people trying to censor his Atlas of Creation in the government schools?

ADNAN OKTAR: Of course it is forbidden to teach them in schools in Turkey. Only books recommended by the Ministry of Education enter into schools. But the Turkish public can easily access my books over the internet. Eighty million of my books have been downloaded this year. About the same number of my books have also been sold. And this has had a huge impact. Our people are particularly amazed at Darwin’s words. For example, Darwin says: “Why, if species have descended from other species by insensibly fine gradations, do we not everywhere see innumerable transitional forms? Why is not all nature in confusion instead of the species being, as we see them, well defined?… But, as by this theory innumerable transitional forms must have existed, why do we not find them embedded in countless numbers in the crust of the earth?… Why then is not every geological formation and every stratum full of such intermediate links? Geology assuredly does not reveal any such finely graduated organic chain; and this, perhaps, is the most obvious and gravest objection which can be urged against my theory.” This is the death of Darwinism. What Darwin was describing then still applies today, in 2009. All the geological strata have been examined, but no intermediate fossils have been found. All that has been found is perfection, the golden mean and symmetry. I have taught or spread this to everyone in Turkey and the world. Darwinism is now history.

PRESENTER: OK. Hang on just a moment, we will spend our last few minutes together, next we have one more short commercial break and then we will continue our discussion more with Adnan Oktar, who goes by the pen name Harun Yahya. He is a Turkish Islamic scholar and an author and he has authored the Atlas of Creation, in 7 volumes. This is a book has been controversial, and it has been attempted to be placed in schools throughout Turkey and the Middle East, even though the governments over there don’t allow it, and it shows Darwinian evolution is false. And basicly we are Christians having a discussion with an Islamic Creationist and you can go to his web site harunyahya.com, that’s pronounced h-a-r-u-n-y-a-h-y-a.com. And we will continue the conversation two minutes from now, here on the Bob Dutko show.

PRESENTER: You’re listening to the Bob Dutka Show, spending our last few minutes with Adnan Oktar, who is a Turkish Islamic scholar. He is also a creationist who argues that Darwinian evolution is false. He goes by the pen name Harun Yahya. He has authored a 7-volume Atlas series, we are talking about this one, Volume 1 Atlas of Creation. And this has caused some controversy around the Middle East. Because many Islamic government schools do not allow creation science evidence to be presented and taught in the schools. Yet he has been trying to get this information into the schools. We are talking to him through his translator, Ahmet Babuna. And so, let me ask Mr. Oktar, you were talking about the fossil record, and I agree with you, there are no transitional fossils, I agree with you. However, you do have some evolutionists who will claim that there are transitional fossils. They will find a fossil of an extinct animal and they will claim that the animal is in fact a transitional fossil. What would you say to those people?

ADNAN OKTAR: Those extinct animals were created with the goldenratio, and are perfect, symmetrical and flawless entities. They have just become extinct. They have no other characteristics. Looking at their chromosome, muscle or nervous structures we see they are perfect and flawless. In order for there to be intermediate fossils, there would have to be asymmetrical, abnormal entities a far cry from the golden ratio, and they would have to number not just in the millions, but in the billions. And everywhere on earth should be packed with such abnormal entities. But we never see any such things. We come across perfectly regular and flawless entities. Mutation causes asymmetrical defects, meaning that an animal’s right side is totally different to its left side. The way they refer to symmetrical and regular animals as transitional life forms is a sign of Darwinists’ despair, of their end. They themselves say these are not intermediate forms. Statements by famous Darwinists make this quite explicit. Ahmet can tell you about them.

Translator: Also the famous Darwinists from today like Niles Eldredge, Steven Jay Gould all of them state that there are no transitional forms. Today’s most famous Darwinists paleontologists confess in their writings that there are no transitional forms.

PRESENTER: Right, well it is a fascinating book, and again it is called the Atlas of Creation. It is authored by Adnan Oktar, but the pen name is Harun Yahya. And again you can go to the web site, harunyahya.com, that’s H-A-R-U-N-Y-A-H-Y-A. And let me say first to Ahmet Babuna thank you so much for translating for us, and to Adnan Oktar. Mr. Oktar, I know we are Christian and you’re Muslim, so I know we do not share the same religious faith. But I do appreciate your willingness to come on and talk with us today about Darwinian evolution. Thank you.

ADNAN OKTAR: Thank you. I love all Christians, all Jews and all Muslims. And I love the Americans. My greetings to you all.