Adnan Oktar: For one thing, one needs to make these people feel who, or what they are. For example, if I came face to face with Dawkins, I would ask him, “How far away from you am I sitting?” He would say, “1.5 meters away.” And I would say, “I am an image in your brain, aren’t I?” “Yes, you are an image in my brain” he will say. "In that case, where is your own image?” He will say, “Inside me. Inside my brain.” “Where is your laboratory?” I will ask, “The lab where you do your research?” He will say, “That is also in my brain.” "Have you ever stepped outside your brain and confronted that laboratory?” And he will say, “No.”

In other words, as I have said before, the human eye is blind and does not see. It is like a technical device. It merely converts the image into an electrical current and transmits it to the brain as that current. The eye in the brain sees, meaning there is an eye that people cannot see. That is the eye of the soul. The ear is deaf, it cannot hear. People imagine they hear through their ears. But the ear is a device that converts sound waves into electricity. It carried them to the brain as weak electric currents. The soul in the brain then perceives that electric current as sound. It is the same with touching with one’s finger tips. People imagine they touch with their finger tips, but that is a sensation in their brains. It appears to be at their finger tips. I first describe these things, and ask the person where he feels he is. He says, for instance, “I am speaking on a TV channel.” But he can actually only speak on the TV channel in his brain. In other words, no human being has ever stepped outside his brain and made direct contact with matter. Because even if one were able to step outside, the outside is pitch black. The Sun, for example, is pitch black and dark. Scientists say, “The Sun has no light.” The Sun emits waves all around. And we see this as light in our brains. We see it is very bright, but it is our brains that interpret that brightness, something unique to the person. There is no sound on the outside, not a peep. That is why the laboratory is in darkness. Because there is no light. Scientists also say, “were it not for the human eye, matter would not be visible.” Since there are so many spaces between the nucleus and the electrons in the atom, matter is transparent and invisible. Scientists say it is the brain that perceives it. It perceives matter as if it existed, but they say that matter is in fact transparent because of all those empty spaces.

Presenter: It is not a solid whole.

Adnan Oktar:Because it is not a solid whole, because if we think of the nucleus of the atom being here, the neutron and proton are in Bahçelievler [in Istanbul]. So there is a huge void involved. But they say the eye perceives it as solid. That is what scientists say.

Presenter: The eye completes it.

Adnan Oktar: In other words, no scientist can have direct experience of a laboratory. People can only experience any laboratory by links through a monitor. In the same way that people conduct research into radioactivity through monitors. Or in keyhole surgery, when the surgeon watches what is happening on a monitor when they insert a tube into the patient. The doctor watches the progress of the device on a monitor. It is the same in the world. People watch it on a monitor. And when they realize this, they confront reality, because it is Allah Who directly creates the image on the monitor screen. It is Allah Who directly imparts the knowledge coming from the outside world.

Presenter: In other words, these things are imparted to us as if pre-programmed, and we see the program as expressed in our brains.

Adnan Oktar: And it is exactly the same with sounds. And these are sounds and images in destiny. And apart from that, one cannot see or perceive anything.